Wheel Machining

[comethead]

Hello all,
Ive noticed at the track that my aluminum Torq Thrust D wheels shed little pieces of metal every time I remove and replace them for rotating. To keep the wear even I’ll rotate them 2 to 3 times a day. Seems like the soft aluminum is no match for the steel lug nuts and the ARP studs.
Cobra Automotive installs steel inserts in the wheels they sell https://store.cobraautomotive.com/wheel ... -thrust-d/
Since I already have the 6 wheels, I just ordered the steel inserts to have my wheels modified. Im still searching for a local machine shop that’s willing to do this. Some wont even look at what I’ve got. They just say no
Anyhow according to the salesman at Cobra Automotive each wheel would need to be “set up on a milling machine, indexing each hole, boring then counter bore and press the insert in.” Got it. I also think he was trying to talk me out of the inserts and into a set of their wheels.
Im starting to lean toward doing it myself if I feel I can get the tolerances exact.
Here’s a similar operation https://youtu.be/TMV2afIJtmM?si=AklUaHk6naMqYfmO

So for anyone familiar with this kinda stuff-
Would this have to be done on a milling machine or would a large drill press be OK?
I may be dreaming but it seems like a straightforward operation- boring a straight hole slightly undersized for a press fit then counter boring for the conical step in the insert.

Heres an insert for reference-




Im not 100% convinced on the DIY route yet but I’d like some opinions.

Joe

[comethead]

By the way Costa Mesa isn’t too far from me, I looked up the machine shop from the video and it seems like the fellow in the video passed away a few years ago and the shop closed. Bummer.

Joe

[SASSY]

Bernie at Bernie's Machine in Saskatoon Sk. could take care of you. Lol
Im sure an independent machine shop with some ties to the racing community could/would help you.
Check with custom wheel shops and fellow racers for leads.
You know me ,Id throw those suckers on the floor face down on a piece of cardboard(if handy, lol) and drill from the back side with my big old 1/2" drill.
Do you use hub centrics?

[A/FX]

Machining a wheel is serious, if it is not done correctly it could cause vibration, or a disaster. A mill is the only machine to use, a drill press is not accurate enough. The inserts should be installed with a zero clearance which means the wheel should be heated and the insert cooled, this expands the aluminum and contracts the steel. When installed in this manner they will never separate unless a press is used. The machining needs to be done precisely, the video made it look easy, believe me to do it correctly is not that easy.
A number of years ago I (we) built a set of Mini lite wheels for one of my projects, the front wheels were narrowed and inch and the rears were widened and inch in width and rim diameter. (14” to 15”) I also built a mold and had aluminum pressure plates and knock off’s cast for them. The machinists had to use special fixtures to make sure the lug nut holes were perfectly aligned to the center of the hub, we did not use the lugs as the centering point, there was an aluminum sleeve that was interference fit to the wheel that located the wheel on the axle stub, the lugs just held the wheel to the hub. The hoops were machined with a step so that when one side was hot and the other cool they would fit together, once together the perimeter of the machined area was tig welded by a certified welder.
Installing the tapered lug nut adapters to a shoulder lug nut wheel is not as complicated but just as critical. Make sure you find a machinist that is well versed in modifying wheels.
Here is how the wheels looked before powder coating, the wheel on the left was 14x7, now 14x6. The wheel on the right has been changed from 14” to 15” with a special offset.



This shows the hidden lug nuts:


Jim

[Joe Travers]

Joe,

Just my dumb opinion but have you considered a set of steel wheels for road racing?
TTDs are nice but I wouldn't try modifying them for the track. Keep a set of street tires on them, slicks on steel.

Joe II

[poboyjo65]

Get a pro to do it Joe. have you ever had a hole go egg shaped when you tried to enlarge it? aluminum & alloys dont play nice all the time. it cakes up on bits & can have a mind of it's own sometimes. surely someone in LA has done this & does it often.

[A/FX]

Try this company:
https://ericvaughnmachine.com/
Eric is well known in the hot rod world as a premier machinist when it comes to wheels.
Jim

[comethead]

Bernie at Bernie's Machine in Saskatoon Sk. could take care of you. Lol
Im sure an independent machine shop with some ties to the racing community could/would help you.
Check with custom wheel shops and fellow racers for leads.
You know me ,Id throw those suckers on the floor face down on a piece of cardboard(if handy, lol) and drill from the back side with my big old 1/2" drill.
Do you use hub centrics?

I knew you’d be the one saying GOOOO!!
Thanks for the input Fred. Im not sure what a hub centric is….pretty good sign i shouldn’t mess with it myself haha!

Thanks Fred!

[comethead]

Machining a wheel is serious, if it is not done correctly it could cause vibration, or a disaster. A mill is the only machine to use, a drill press is not accurate enough. The inserts should be installed with a zero clearance which means the wheel should be heated and the insert cooled, this expands the aluminum and contracts the steel. When installed in this manner they will never separate unless a press is used. The machining needs to be done precisely, the video made it look easy, believe me to do it correctly is not that easy.
A number of years ago I (we) built a set of Mini lite wheels for one of my projects, the front wheels were narrowed and inch and the rears were widened and inch in width and rim diameter. (14” to 15”) I also built a mold and had aluminum pressure plates and knock off’s cast for them. The machinists had to use special fixtures to make sure the lug nut holes were perfectly aligned to the center of the hub, we did not use the lugs as the centering point, there was an aluminum sleeve that was interference fit to the wheel that located the wheel on the axle stub, the lugs just held the wheel to the hub. The hoops were machined with a step so that when one side was hot and the other cool they would fit together, once together the perimeter of the machined area was tig welded by a certified welder.
Installing the tapered lug nut adapters to a shoulder lug nut wheel is not as complicated but just as critical. Make sure you find a machinist that is well versed in modifying wheels.
Here is how the wheels looked before powder coating, the wheel on the left was 14x7, now 14x6. The wheel on the right has been changed from 14” to 15” with a special offset.



This shows the hidden lug nuts:


Jim

Dang Jim thanks for the eye opening!! You’ve scared the bejeezus outta me enough to not want to mess with this one. Im going to give the shop you linked a call. Thank you!

[comethead]

Joe,

Just my dumb opinion but have you considered a set of steel wheels for road racing?
TTDs are nice but I wouldn't try modifying them for the track. Keep a set of street tires on them, slicks on steel.

Joe II

I had a set and they were heavier than these aluminum ones so I sold them. I think I’m going to stick with these and either A) destroy them beyond use lol or B) find a shop to do the wok for me

Thanks Joe!

[comethead]

Get a pro to do it Joe. have you ever had a hole go egg shaped when you tried to enlarge it? aluminum & alloys dont play nice all the time. it cakes up on bits & can have a mind of it's own sometimes. surely someone in LA has done this & does it often.

Ugh thanks Johnnie.. you’re right. Ill sit this one out and try to find a pro

Joe

[comethead]

Try this company:
https://ericvaughnmachine.com/
Eric is well known in the hot rod world as a premier machinist when it comes to wheels.
Jim

Thanks again Jim!

[Joe Travers]

I had a set and they were heavier than these aluminum ones so I sold them. I think I’m going to stick with these and either A) destroy them beyond use lol or B) find a shop to do the wok for me

Thanks Joe!

Yeah, I figured the car handles better w/ aluminum but thinking of safety. Had a AR aluminum wheel crack on me many years ago. Thank goodness I wasn't driving 100+ mph when it occurred.

Don't destroy your wheels, man!

Joe II